Excerpts of Talks between Leading Comrades and Foreign Guests (No. 8)

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Serial No.  000026

Excerpts of Talks between Leading Comrades and Foreign Guests (No. 8)

October 4, 1982

Contents
Comrade Deng Xiaoping Discusses Foreign Policy and International Issues

Comrade Deng Xiaoping Discusses Foreign Policy and International Issues

Comrade Deng Xiaoping, in a recent meeting with UN Secretary-General Pérez de Cuéllar and French National Assembly Speaker Louis Mermaz, outlined our foreign policy and our views on a number of international issues.

Comrade Deng Xiaoping said in his meeting with Pérez de Cuéllar on August 21: If a person from a developed country can be the Secretary General of the United Nations, why shouldn't a person from the Third World be the Secretary General? China belongs to the Third World and, as a permanent member of the Security Council, has a special status. China declares that it belongs to the Third World and will never be a hegemon and so China should do things for the Third World.

Comrade Deng Xiaoping said: China is both big and small. China is big in that it has both a large population and a large territory. China is small in that it is at a low level of economic development.  Peru and Pakistan are more economically developed than we are, not to mention other countries represented here. China understands its responsibilities.  You all trust China. You can trust China because it sticks to its principles, and because it does not play political games, games with words, or play political cards. When Chairman Mao and Premier Zhou led China, this was the way we were. Our foreign policy has been consistent, first, to oppose hegemony, second, to maintain world peace and third, and to strengthen cooperation with the Third World. 

The United States and the Soviet Union are hegemonic. The U.S. and Soviet Union are engaged in hegemony, and the victims are the Third World, not Japan, Western Europe, Canada, and Oceania.

Canada, Oceania, and Eastern Europe suffered some.  Since World War II, there have been no big wars but an endless series of small wars. The root cause was the superpowers' hegemony, provocation and finger-pointing.  The ones who suffered from that were the countries of the Third World.

The invasion of Cambodia and Laos by Vietnam is also hegemony, a small regional hegemony. Without the support of big hegemony, small hegemony is not possible. Vietnam belongs to the Third World, but it is hegemonic. In the long run, the Vietnamese people themselves will suffer from hegemony.  Not Vietnamese leaders, but the Vietnamese people.

Where does a world war start?  We can't ignore the possibility that the Soviet Union might attack Europe. While a direct Soviet attack on Western Europe was not unlikely, what it has is a roundabout strategy. After occupying Afghanistan, it would pursue a southward policy in order to control warm water ports in the Indian Ocean, then control the Middle East in the east of Europe. After the Soviet Union took control of the Middle East oil region and grasped the neck of the continent, Europe would be faced with two choices, resist or submit. Instead of making a choice then, it is better to make a decision now. In the case of Cambodia and Afghanistan, we must now firmly support the people of Cambodia and Afghanistan in their struggle to resist aggression.

The Third World is the world's most important force for the maintenance of world peace and opposing hegemony. This is determined by the status of the Third World and is not subject to the will of any one person.  We draw attention to the danger of world war, but we are not pessimists. The factors favoring war are growing but also the factors running against it are growing as well. There are several newly independent countries and the Third World is getting stronger.  Taking these factors into account, we can see that hegemony will continue to exist but that the time when it could master the world has definitively ended.  The Third World, poor as it is, cannot be ignored by anyone in world politics. Third World coordination is not ideal and its problems are very complex.  Work needs to be done. China's strength and the role that it can play is limited.

Some people say that China has a special position in the Third World. We don't agree with that. China is only one member of the Third World.   Many say that China is the leader of the third world.  We can't be the leader and having the reputation of being the leader is a bad thing. I am not being polite here. This is a real political consideration.

The superpowers have long used the Third World in their conflicts.  In recent years, old problems haven't been solved and new problems keep emerging. There has been no detente in international politics.  We do not believe in any political détente or disarmament, but we do favor negotiations. 

Some people say that China is warlike, but China wants peace more than anything else or at least 20 years without war. We are preoccupied now with economic development and freeing ourselves from backwardness.  Our first task is to achieve Chinese modernization in this century, with the initial goal of establishing a moderately prosperous society.

Then we will be at a new starting point, and in another 30 to 50 years we will be close to the level of the developed countries. We will not catch up with or surpass them, but will be close to them. We will not fear war if it is imposed upon us.

Comrade Deng Xiaoping said that the UN could not solve all problems, but the UN would play a greater role than it has in the past.

Comrade Xiaoping said in a meeting with Louis Mermaz on August 31: It is not easy to deal with the Vietnamese.  They are engaged in a kind of hegemony called regional hegemony, which is supported by big hegemony.  That is the essence of the problem. The key now is that Vietnam must withdraw its troops. This is fundamental.  Apart from that, nothing can be discussed.  An important principle of international politics is not to allow aggression against others. Our hope for France is twofold: First, we hope that the French government will support the coalition government of Cambodia; second, we hope that France will support Democratic Kampuchea's seat in the United Nations General Assembly. 

On the Middle East issue, Comrade Deng Xiaoping said that what happened in Lebanon was done by Israel with the support of the United States. The US is also hegemonic. It not only tolerates but it also supports and condones Israeli aggression. I appreciate the French position on the Palestinian issue. Without the support of the United States, Israel's aggression would not have been possible. I have talked with Americans many times about this. The United States has several "aircraft carriers" in the world, Israel is one and Taiwan is another. On the issue of Israel, Comrade Deng Xiaoping said that Israel already exists.  That was a mistake made by the United Nations. Now that Israel exists, it cannot be wiped off the face of the earth.